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Helping Project Managers grow and master their project management skills while sharing the stories of other project management professionals.
PM-Mastery
Transitioning Between Industries: A Project Manager's Journey with Walt Sparling
Ever wonder how someone becomes a successful project manager? Walt Sparling's remarkable journey from an accidental drafting student to a cross-industry PM expert reveals the unexpected path many professionals take into this dynamic field.
This is a unique episode where Walt, the host of the PM-Mastery podcast, let a former guest and friend interview him. During this interview, we discussed future goals of meeting each other in person, but due to the delayed posting of this episode, it actually happened, and Tanya was a guest at a milestone birthday party of mine this past summer. It was awesome to meet in person and finally create that personal bond that we had been building over the last couple of years.
Walt's story begins with childhood dreams of architecture that took a detour when an eye injury ended his military aspirations. From there, his career winds through mechanical engineering firms, an IT startup, and eventually into architectural project management. What makes his perspective so valuable is how each role built upon the last, creating a uniquely qualified professional who understands the complex connections that link different technical disciplines.
Throughout the conversation with host Tanya Boyd, Walt emphasizes how communication became his superpower. "If your attention to detail is good, you manage time well, and you're a great communicator—you can work in multiple industries," he explains. This insight reveals that successful project managers don't necessarily possess deep technical expertise in one area, but rather possess the ability to facilitate understanding among specialists and guide teams towards shared goals through influence rather than authority.
The discussion takes fascinating turns through Walt's PM Mastery podcast creation during COVID, his involvement with a men's mastermind group, and his role as an instructor for the Pure Project Manager credential. This innovative program brings together over 20 industry experts, each teaching their specialty rather than having "one person talk about 15 different topics." The result is practical, specialized knowledge from professionals passionate about their focus areas.
Whether you're an aspiring project manager curious about the field, a seasoned PM looking to broaden your perspective, or someone considering a career pivot, Walt's story demonstrates how adaptability, communication skills, and a willingness to learn can create opportunities across industries. Ready to take your project management skills to the next level? This episode provides both inspiration and practical insights to help you on your journey.
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Welcome to the PM Mastery Podcast. This podcast is all about helping you master your project management skills by sharing tips, tricks, tools and training to get you to the next level, while sharing the stories of other project managers on their journey in project management. And now here's your host.
Tanya Boyd:Hi, this is Tanya Boyd, and I'm hosting Walt Sparling on his podcast, pm Mastery today. Both Walt and I are instructors with the Pure Project Manager credential and we're here to talk a little bit about how he got involved in this and give you a little bit backstory into who Walt is and how he got started. So thank you for allowing me to interview you today, Walt. How are you doing today?
Walt Sparling:I'm doing great. This is fun. It's nice to be on the other side of the table occasionally.
Tanya Boyd:Absolutely. You got to flip the screws sometimes. So just tell me something a little bit fun about your hobbies and interests outside of work before we get into everything. Project manager-y.
Walt Sparling:Well, sadly, project management is a little bit of my hobby because obviously the podcast, the website, so I do that when I'm not working and then I do project management when I work. Other than that, I belong to a men's mastermind and we get together and we do planning goals and we do presentations and it's kind of a success group to help men grow and succeed in different areas of their life. So that's another thing I do every three weeks and then I do, like occasional, bourbon and cigars.
Tanya Boyd:That sounds good. So how long have you been involved in the Men's Mastermind? For how many years now?
Walt Sparling:We're coming up, I think, on the eighth year. It's been crazy and we do a big retreat every year, which we didn't do this year. There was all the storms and stuff that happened down here. Everyone had damage and we kind of put it on the back burner. We had hoped to schedule one late and that didn't happen, so we missed out this year.
Tanya Boyd:So that was for 2025, or do you have any plans to do it later in 2025?
Walt Sparling:We usually do it the last month. So we do it the first weekend of December every year. The weather's good and we usually find a big house somewhere and it's usually eight or nine, sometimes 10 guys. But this year half of the people had damage and were, you know, had issues that they had to get through. So we tried to set it up in March and then some other things happened and that didn't happen. So we'll go back to our normal routine and pick up again in 25 and do on, hopefully to our normal schedule, which will be the first week of December.
Tanya Boyd:Well, hopefully Mother Nature plays a little bit nicer this year. I mean, even in project management, those enterprise environmental factors it's something that you know is a risk of happening, but you can never completely plan for it when it does happen. So I want to dive into your work history a little bit. So you're just going through your LinkedIn, it looks like you've got a diverse history in mechanical engineering and architecture, so tell me how, from that, you evolved into project management.
Walt Sparling:All right, I'll try to make this short, but it's been a career-long journey. I started out wanting to be an architect when I was a kid. Actually, I got put in a drafting class by accident and I really loved it. So I started drawing. I was making straight A's, I was doing great. I said, well, this is easy and fun. So I decided I was going to be an architect.
Walt Sparling:But I went in the military because I had also been in ROTC and two weeks after I enlisted, of course I wanted to go in and be like a naval architect you know, do ships and all that and my dad's like, no, you got to go into technology. And my dad's like, no, you gotta go into technology. So, uh, anyway, I got injured outside. I did an early enlistment, um was injured on a weekend, lost my eye, one of my eyes, my right eye and uh, they discharged me. So I had spent years in rtc civil air patrol all getting ready to go in the service. I was already enlisted and two weeks after I was out. So I'm like all right. I got out of the hospital, a school called say hey, we're looking at your grades. You seem really good in drafting. So I went to a school in Tampa, got out of there, couldn't find a job right away with an architect, started with a mechanical engineering firm as a drafter, really enjoyed that, spent quite a few years doing that and then transitioned.
Walt Sparling:I went back to school to try to get my degree for to become an architect and during that time I worked at another mechanical firm and then I was doing a lot of IT stuff on the side, helping firms, and I ended up starting an IT company. So I left the mechanical role and did this IT company for about six years, hit a downturn in the economy, I had to let go of a couple people and then all the work work that I was trying to get came in and it was just me and I was freaked out. I sold the company to someone I knew who was working with another IT company and I went to work for a client and did ITs a little bit more. Then I went back and got a job with an architect doing actual architectural work and that was my first title as a project manager. I mean, all the work I did had project management duties related, but it never had the title, and so that was my first title job and then I left there when the owner passed away a few years after I was there, so went to another architectural firm passed away a few years after I was there, so went to another architectural firm and then from there things didn't work out.
Walt Sparling:Went to back to a mechanical firm, then an electrical firm and then someone approached me and poached me from that one to go to another electrical firm, poached me from that one to go to another electrical firm. So I've done architectural, mechanical, electrical plumbing. The only thing I never really did much of is fire protection. But so I'm very versed in the design portion because I've spent almost well 30 years on that side. And my last job I was working with an electrical engineering firm. I knew the owner was going to be retiring soon and I just couldn't imagine me going back at the current age. I was then back as a designer somewhere else and, uh, I decided to go full out on project management. Get my pmp uh, learn more about the formal side of it instead of just the you know the everyday that we did. You know the accidental project managers.
Tanya Boyd:Right right.
Walt Sparling:So during that process a friend of mine was a PM and she said they were looking for a PM at her firm and it was a senior level. And I'm like I it's not me, I'm still, you know, kind of learning the ropes. And she said some very flowerful words and said send your resume. So I did, I got hired and over seven years I worked my way up through that to the team lead position and then a regional lead and then left there early last year and transitioned to a new account Same role owner's rep, owner's rep slash project manager in working on construction projects. So it's been eight years with this firm and probably a total of 15 years doing project management officially.
Tanya Boyd:I wanted to backtrack a little bit over some of just the different story and the different pieces of the story that you've told me. So first wanted to start by saying thank you for your service. I know you admitted that you were just it was honorable discharge due to an injury, but I still want to acknowledge that because I think the thought, the heart and the intent was all there. You know, and, that being said, even the resilience and adaptability and going into all of these different roles, how challenging was it for you to adapt to all those changes of those different roles and what were some of the things in the mindset that got you through those different periods?
Walt Sparling:It's interesting. I mean, I had to adapt when I had planned for years to go in the military and then get in you're sworn in, that's your future and then to have that crushed in a couple weeks. I put me in kind of a tailspin and then when the school approached, that gave me a little bit of brightness. So went to school, got to move away from home and go out of town into the big city, and so my whole life has been, you know, one challenge after another, and not negative challenges, some are negative, some are positive. But transitioning to when I couldn't find a job with an architectural firm. I didn't have enough experience, no one wanted to take a chance on me. I found a mechanical firm that did, and they were super happy they did, and so was I. I learned a mechanical firm that did, and they were super happy they did, and so was I. I learned a lot there.
Walt Sparling:When I left there, it was because I decided to go back to school, and so it wasn't one of those things where I lost the job. It was just hey, if I want to go back to school, I need to spend time job. It was just a hey, if I want to go back to school. I need to spend time. I need to move back home because I'm not going to be able to afford to work and go to school. But I worked weekends. I'd go back to Tampa and work on the weekend, stay with a friend, then I'd go back to school during the week, and I did that for a while. The company got really slow. They didn't have any weekend work for me, so I had to find another job. So I struggled for a little while and I found another mechanical job. So that was a transition that worked out very well. I learned a ton of information from the owner. It was a small engineering firm firm and he taught me a lot and I greatly value the time I spent there.
Walt Sparling:And then it was that while I was there that I started my company and he actually encouraged it. He, he let me take time off, he goes. I can tell you're passionate about this. He said you know why don't you work four days a week and work on your company one? And then, um, then it went to two and then he said well, that's it. If you're going to go more, you need to go full time. So I did and, uh, did that for many years and, um, like I said, it was an uh economic thing that made me change jobs there.
Walt Sparling:But I was always able to bounce back, whether it was uh, either I was offered a role that was a better fit and I would go, or I hit some kind of uh negative downturn and then had to spin, or pivot, as they say, in into a new role. But I always landed on my feet, which was good. You know, it was sometimes a struggle for a little bit, but just over time, uh, just kept finding out, dealing with whatever the hurdle was. I've I've actually never, I've always.
Walt Sparling:I was laid off one time and all the other times it was my choice to leave a role. And when I was laid off I was so foreign to me, I was like what? And my wife was like you know, just take your time. You've you've been to a lot of different roles. Figure out what you want to do, don't worry about it. A company offered me a part-time job just while, cause they heard about me getting laid off and they're like hey, we'll give you some weekend work and you can while you're searching. And then they, when I went in to talk to them about it, they said you know, we changed our mind, we just like to hire you full time. So it was in a trade I had never worked in which was electrical.
Tanya Boyd:Right.
Walt Sparling:And they said we know your background so we'll train you. I learned I did. I spent the next six years between there and one other firm, because another firm called me and said would you be interested in coming over here? And so it was another positive switch and that ultimately led me to the job that I have now, which I've been at just shy of eight years.
Tanya Boyd:Got another kind of theoretical question, but with just the different changes that you've gone through. If you were to give advice to incoming project managers, would you tell them that having kind of that diversity in different fields is a good thing? You know, because there's all the different industries the agile talk, the generalist, the subject matter expert I tend to hold the opinion that having experience in multiple industries can actually be a huge benefit. What's your thoughts?
Walt Sparling:on that I agree, and that is a hugely debated topic. Some say specialize, some say generalize. I, since I was young, I was always like I am. You know, how does that saying go?
Tanya Boyd:Jack of all trades, master of none. Yeah, we call it Jill of all hills.
Walt Sparling:Yeah. So that is something a lot of people say oh, no, you should specialize, or no, no, you should generalize. I think everybody's path is different. So to just say that you should do one or the other, you've got to kind of see what is your journey like and is there? I mean, do you have interest in learning a lot of different things? I love learning new things. So that's automatically going to make me more general, because I'm going to spend time on this, learn that and go. Okay, I got a pretty good handle on it. No, I want to learn this and do that. It has paid off for me because it's made me very flexible. It paid off for me because it's made me very flexible.
Walt Sparling:And when I've moved into new roles, even on the design side, they appreciated the fact that I had done other trades, so I knew how they interacted. So I wasn't just doing electrical without understanding mechanical and plumbing. I had already done that. And because I had spent time in architecture and I had wanted to be an architect, I had that mindset as well, so I could relate to how that's going to aesthetically look. You know most people say, well, it's just a functional thing, like, no, it's not going to look good or it's not, you know. So learning that and then understanding working with facilities, people about maintenance, making sure equipment is easy to get to, and I also learned a lot of that from the first engineer. Second engineer at the firm I worked with is he was very practical and he was very detail oriented and an excellent communicator. So I picked up a lot of my knowledge when I worked with him.
Tanya Boyd:I'm just going to say, and you touched on another point that made me think. So you know, just before I ask that question, which version of the Project Management Book of Knowledge did you pass the P&P on?
Walt Sparling:I most on five, and just missed it, and it was so late at the end of the book that I, when I went back to retest, it was on six.
Tanya Boyd:It was on six. Well, when you were talking about how the different industries that you worked on helps you to basically see the forest for the trees and how things interconnect, you know there was such a huge shift in PMBOK 7. It was such a big departure from 6. But I remember that one of the things that they prioritized was systems thinking. You know and that's just for those that may be listening that's the ability to zoom in and out of projects so you can go in deep, you can see all the details, but you can zoom back and figure out the strategy and how things are interconnected. And I do think that's a benefit to working on different projects, different industries. You just get more of an overview of how, the way the world works and even different personality types, which that kind of brings me to my next thing, which will bring us into your courses shortly. So at what point in your career did you really start prioritizing communication, in realizing how influential, appropriate and effective listening and communication can be on project success?
Walt Sparling:I wanted to be funny, but you can be funny.
Tanya Boyd:We appreciate fun here.
Walt Sparling:I think it's a learned process. But because of the diversity in my job roles, uh I'm I dealt with a lot of people, but I think my biggest, uh first, I think the first experience was with the one engineer who was very detail oriented and he, when he would say why he did things, he would say about how that's going to minimize confusion and it's going to clarify ideas. We're going to get less phone calls, things are going to go smoother, and it's all because what I determined later was that is one form of communication is the written and the visual that you did on drawings. So it's not just how you speak. That you did on drawings, so it's not just how you speak.
Walt Sparling:So then when I was doing IT, I had my IT company and I dealt with customers all over the place. Most of them were architects and engineers, because that's how I got in with them is they knew me from the industry. But I would build machines, set up networks, customize their software, and so I dealt with the end users. I dealt with the owners of the company, I dealt with vendors that we bought material from. So there was a lot of communication going on and you just learn the way you interact with someone, you can see the benefit, you can see how they treat you. If you snap at someone or you see someone else do it and you see the other person react, okay, well, don't do that, because that's not a good thing. And you want to also minimize time. So if I can say something in a detailed way and they get it and I don't just hey.
Walt Sparling:I don't go on and on about something, or I don't just give a very short answer and go. You know I want this. Well, why do you want that? You know, when do you need it? You know it's okay, I need this, I want it here and this is what I need it for that's.
Tanya Boyd:It's the happy medium and figuring out with the different stakeholders and their different personality types what constitutes that happy medium. Well, before we jump into Pure, I wanted you to tell me a little bit about how you got into podcasting and what were some of the most interesting things on getting started with that journey, the challenges and what you learned about yourself and other people.
Walt Sparling:Well, I think with a lot of people during COVID, I had a little bit of spare time and I was working from home, which I had not been for. I was used to being in the field or in the office on a daily basis. So I was a little stir crazy and we had taken a weekend trip to visit family. It was later on in covid and uh, I was like I had talked to some friends online and um or on the phone and they said you should start a podcast. I was like, well, why, nico, you got that voice, the radio voice, you know. And I'm like, okay, but I need a topic. And so I was thinking about it on a trip and I thought, well, wait, I'm big into project management. I've been, you know, pushing people on it, I've been studying for it, I've done pretty well in it, so why not do that? So that's what I did Once.
Walt Sparling:I got uh kind of tuned into that I would wake up in the middle of the night with ideas for titles for the podcast, and I had done websites before, so the blog and all that were easy deal to set up. It was just trying to learn about podcasting, so I tend to be one of those that dives in and I'm not a, you know, like a lot of people say, fake it till you make it or, you know, don't, don't wait, just dive in and figure it out as you go. And I've never been that kind of person. I'm getting more that way now, but back then it was like I'm going to learn everything there is. I researched mics, I researched uh, researched the cords that you use. I researched the software, the editing, the recording. I watched other podcasters, I listened to podcast coaches, and I did that for about six months and then I, finally I talked to a friend of mine, a PM that I worked with, and asked her if she would, you know, if she was interested in being involved and maybe as a co-host, um, or at least interview me on my first interview. And she did, and she's co-hosted a few episodes with me.
Walt Sparling:But once I got started, I had a bunch of people lined up and, uh, I, like I said, I had all my gear in place, I had practiced and, uh, it went really well. And then I did have, you know, a lot of people were excited about it, but then they got scared and they backed out and the first year was very bumpy and second year got better, third year got better and now, like right now, I'm in a lull because we just bought a new house and we're trying to get out of our old house and we're exhausted, so I don't have a lot of time to do recordings and editings and and all that. So it's been a very slow last uh month or two, but I already like today, I put out my newsletter on LinkedIn and and I've already got a bunch of ideas.
Walt Sparling:I'm collaborating with some other people on some potential lives and then one that we have coming is going to be really interesting. It's going to be interviewing the spouses of PMs.
Tanya Boyd:Oh, my God. Oh yes, that should be a hot topic, Just to see what they've picked up about project management, or if they do pick up anything anymore. If they just tune out the project managers Because I think that's a popular tactic sometimes is okay. Let's not talk about work, you know, and not everything's a project.
Walt Sparling:And it was. It came up, you know, clinton Brooks, herman.
Tanya Boyd:Yeah, I sure do.
Walt Sparling:Yep, yep, his wife is the one that brought it up and I was like, oh, I like that idea. And we started going back and forth brainstorming and then I started reaching out to PMs that I knew and it was surprising. I started reaching out to PMs that I'd interviewed in the past, that I knew were married and had heard a lot of their stories. So I was like would you think your spouse would be interested in coming on and doing this? And they were. Most of them were like, yes, but what I did find out is there was a pretty decent size audience that both were PMs. Can you imagine two PMs in the same relationship?
Tanya Boyd:No, I couldn't. That would be really really, really extra. I you know so. I'm a PM but I don't over plan things. I have friends that color code their menus and everything they do. They put absolutely everything on a Gantt chart and I'm like I can't plan it down to that level. Now it depends upon the project. I imagine for moving houses you probably did, because that's a super huge project where a lot of these I did checklists.
Walt Sparling:I'm a big checklist guy. I didn't really do a Gantt chart, we just did.
Walt Sparling:I would schedule stuff and say, okay, this weekend you know I do Google Keep a lot to make my notes and then I'll transfer them into Excel and into Outlook but I would say, okay, this weekend we're going to do this. My wife was really instrumental in helping with the moves. I was more of logistics and, you know, manpower and uh, just making sure. Okay, like even when the movers came, like this is how I want you to pack the truck and like these guys are professional movers and I was like this is how you want to do it, because this is how I want to unload it and all that. But they were good with it, right. So yeah, there was a little bit of design on everywhere everything goes.
Walt Sparling:No, but when I did my studio, which was one of the sad things that I left behind. I sketched that out on paper and then I created a little mini schedule on that and a budget which I blew. Wow, yep. But yeah, I'm a planner. I'll spend almost as much time planning something as I do it, but I do believe, over my experience of being in design for so long, that planning is so key. You can over plan, but when you under plan, it will bite you in the butt.
Tanya Boyd:You're right. I do that with road trips, like I probably do plan road trips differently. Because I want to be. I do so much research before to identify where it is that I want to visit and I almost backwards pass my time that I've got to figure out how I go to places and how I map it out to get there, and then I'll insert my project management joke that sometimes I have to force myself to be a little bit more agile because it is vacation and I need to like come up off the reins of that just to leave the unknown and the fun and the non-routine in there, so that the vacation feels a little bit more spontaneous than over-architected.
Walt Sparling:Do you schedule in some spontaneity?
Tanya Boyd:I do, I do Well, and plus, there's a lot of times that the Wi-Fi goes out or that I'm not following the map correctly, so I get lost, and so, you know's, as long as I'm not wandering out in the woods with the bears before dark, I try to calm myself down and not freak out and just figure out how to get out of there. You know, but sometimes I'll tell you, some of my funnest moments actually come from those areas of concern where you're lost and then the trip that that leads you on. And so that's kind of the humor in life when things don't go according to plan, sometimes we need to adjust our mindset and just figure out when we need to laugh at it and not get really upset like flat tires on New Year's Day. But thankfully there was a tire place, one tire place that was open in West Texas on that day, so that worked out. I don't know how the story would have been had that one place not been open.
Tanya Boyd:So, but I want to give us some time to talk about the QR Project Manager credential. And so, for those of you listening to the podcast, what this is, this is a program that was put together with over 20 instructors. It was Joseph Phillips who was the head of this. Him and his wonderful team that worked with over 20 of us that came up with our own topics, learned how to do content creation not just from the storyboarding but also the recording of our courses. You know so, walt, how did you get first pulled into it? And I'd love for you to tell us about your topic and the inspiration for that, about your topic and the inspiration for that.
Walt Sparling:So I am fortunate that I know Joseph Phillips and I haven't known him forever, but I've known him for a few years and I took one of his courses or a couple of his courses when I was studying for my PMP years ago, and I happened to join one of his Facebook groups and one day we started a side chat, I think I messaged him about something and we would occasionally chat DMs and we found out that we were both into cigars and bourbon and so we would compare notes and if one of us was sitting out on a weekend smoking a cigar I'd send a DM to the other person. And then I told him about my podcast and didn't. I was nervous about inviting him because even then I was like, oh, this guy's a big guy, you know he's, he's huge. He'll never come on the podcast. So he called me one day and we had chatted a lot and he said hey, I've got a new book coming out. Would you be interested in reviewing it for me? You be interested in reviewing it for me? And I'm like, wow, sure. And I said, but there's a caveat If I review your book, you have to come on my podcast. So I actually had him on the podcast and we hit it off. We did a lot of, a lot of talking and sharing and so we became even closer.
Walt Sparling:So when this program came up, he had hinted at it um, like six months before something was coming. He couldn't share a lot, but he would call me when it, when it actually became real, and we were out having cigars one night when he, when he told me this and I'm like I can't, I can't imagine what this is going to be, and then he called me when he kicked it off and told me what was going on, he goes you know, come up with a topic that you'd like to talk about and, uh, let's get you on the program. He explained what he was trying to do and I'm like, oh, I love that, that's a great way of uh, I haven't seen that approach. So, with it being more real life, people that give day-to-day what I like to call boots on the ground experiences. So if you have your PMP, you have that theoretical experience and the history of how they built the PMP and changed it over the years, and then you have also practical knowledge from people that are doing it on a regular basis. So I think they're complimentary in that regards, but it was exciting.
Walt Sparling:It was a lot of work creating it. I did my inspiration. Communication is one of my things. Communication and process are my two kind of go-tos. But I had just finished writing a chapter in a book for John Connolly's Executing Excellence and I thought, well, that's pretty fresh. Why don't I just take that and expand on it and turn it into a course? So that's what I did. I told Joe and I wrote up an outline and sent it to him and his team approved it and that's how I got into it.
Tanya Boyd:Bring up the book Executed Excellence into it. Bring up the book Executed Excellence, and I think that is so cool too, because I was connected with. I was connected with you, you know, and a lot of the other people in this program, like John Connolly, melissa Chapman, jeremiah Hammond, you know, and I know we're all contributors to that book as well. Can you speak a little bit and again, imagine y'all were kind of all working off sides but had some planning committees. Can I ask you how that was, when y'all realized y'all were back on another creative project for something new together, because that had to be pretty cool.
Walt Sparling:Yeah, I was pretty excited when John reached out to me and I know he had a ton of followers and I didn't have a lot of followers. I was still trying to build up my my rep and and it when we had had a few conversations and I had had him on a panel, a live panel, I had interviewed him, so it when he reached out to me and asked me about doing the chapter, I was like wow, that's, that's cool. So I did it and got to interact with, like you said, some of the other authors in a private group on linkedin. And then when joe did his announcement and brought everybody together, it was interesting because in fact, I did my first post on it right after it went live. I'd say over half of the instructors I've interviewed on the podcast, some of them multiple times, so it was kind of cool to see, you know, when we did the first get together the entire group when it was kicked off, and like oh, I know that person and that person and I know them and I've just talked with them the other day.
Walt Sparling:And then I saw a bunch of new folks, Some of them I'd heard of before but never interacted with, and some were were completely new to me and then some of them we've gotten closer Like I had never worked with Dave Westgarth before.
Tanya Boyd:But we hit it off Well, and that's this brings me to another topic. You know and this is really for our listeners too, because I feel like it's something that you and I are both going to agree with Would you yet? I have met Ben Chan in person, because both he and I have been at some of the larger PMI events. Jeremiah and I talk all the time, I have his book, but never met him in person. So what about you? Have you met any of the other creators in person yet? And what would you say about the power of LinkedIn and networking and opportunities?
Walt Sparling:Definitely believe in the LinkedIn, networking and putting yourself out there, and the more I'm out there, the more people I follow. I mean I'm getting followers, which is great, and then some of them I follow back because I realize that they're content creators and sharers and not just content for the purpose of making money or getting famous, but because they have something good to say and they have an opinion they want to share. And I have learned a lot from just the people that I've connected with and some of them have grown into like you and I have. We've chatted a lot and we've never met in person, like you said, but when we get on, I'm gonna.
Tanya Boyd:I need to figure that out because I and we've never met in person, like you said, but when we get on the phone, I need to figure that out because I'm like you're in Florida, joe's in Florida, ellen's in Florida, jeff is in Florida, adam's in Florida. I'm like I need to work this out at some point with the schedule.
Walt Sparling:We'll get that figured out out, but I yeah I have not the only person I have met in this entire circle in person, other than, of course joe is um uh brooks clinton brooks herman, yeah, yeah, he um, I actually was on a uh, um pmp, um PMP course, a bootcamp with him years ago. Right, in fact you had introduced me to someone and that we were talking about doing an interview. Uh, she was in that same course.
Tanya Boyd:Okay, I did not even realize that, and it's it is the weirdest thing because it winds up being a very small world Like and and that's the cool thing with linkedin, I mean, I I did have the fortune of talking and I know, you know, kayla mcguire, you were on the book, you've interviewed her, I had my first call with her a few weeks ago and and I think she's absolutely amazing, you know, and so it just for me realizing how powerful LinkedIn is, how connections can grow, and not limiting yourself just to local, you know. So, not even for the project management, education, but for jobs. You know, I know there's a lot of places that are going back to the office, but there's still plenty of remote work that, with meeting the right people, having the right mindset and, you know again, through the weird world, having the right resume, there's still a lot of different possibilities that are out there.
Walt Sparling:Well, I just want to share something that I think is interesting, especially if there's new people listening, because I try to share this whenever I can. I was at a dinner last night with my wife and with some of her co-workers and they asked me what I did and I told them and one of the salesmen said his son was going to school for an actual project management degree and later on in the evening I told him about the podcast and said he might be interested in checking it out. So then all the questions came out and a lot of people they ask you you know, what do you do as I'm a project manager, and like, oh, they don't like it. Well, whatever that is, you know. And some ask you well, what do you mean? What do you? What do you manage?
Walt Sparling:So trying to explain your story is really interesting, but the diversity in project management is so great. I mean there are project management professionals in every industry. There's so many opportunities and if you really learn the core key skills mostly soft skills, but understand, I mean, if your attention to detail, you're good with your time management and you're a great communicator, which is one of my favorites you can work in multiple industries because you have that skill set to listen and think things through and then help guide people down a path of hey, we got a schedule, we got a budget, we got scope and a deadline, now let's get it done.
Tanya Boyd:We've got a schedule, we've got a budget, we've got scope and a deadline. Now let's get it done Right. And it's a tricky balance of influence too. I think that's the biggest thing that people mistake with project management and influence and guide people and really learn that communication to ask the right questions, to try to inspire some people to their finish line, to get the project done, but without having the authority.
Walt Sparling:So it's yeah, Project managers a lot, especially I've seen in younger ones. It is not an authority thing. You might have some in some companies, but most of the time it's an influence. And I've worked with a couple of young PMs and they were like, okay, my facilities people are my contractor. I'm like none of them are yours, None of them are yours.
Walt Sparling:None of their years, no you work with them, you're all on the same team and you're helping manage this project, but they don't work for you they do not, and that's it's a tough to learn and it's a tough pill to swallow.
Tanya Boyd:and then even I remember when I was first getting into project management, when people on other teams weren't completing things to the level that they needed to complete them, I always held back from being, I guess, the tattler. You know I didn't want to raise the red flag on them. It's like I try to talk to them first and coach and motivate and find out the real issue. You know, but sometimes too you do just have to note things and get with their executives too and sort of get past that feeling of I'm throwing somebody under the bus, you know, but if influence on any level and trying to motivate people and move them forward as best you can, I think is some of the best advice with project management.
Walt Sparling:That's what I've seen, and it works.
Tanya Boyd:Well, I wanted to say thank you for the time and the level of detail that you've given during this interview too. I think I've gotten to learn a lot about you as a friend too, that I wouldn't have realized had we not had this opportunity. So, and I want to give you the last chance to say anything to the audience, whether it's on pure or motivation or ideas.
Walt Sparling:I didn't plan a speech. No, I just want to say that there's a ton of great courses in the peer program and I am happy and honored to be a part of it. It was great also that I actually taught mine with Joe. It was interesting how that happened and it's the only course like that, um. So that was a lot of fun and I have taken multiple of the other courses. I haven't completed them all yet, but great material and it is very interesting to to hear that material from someone who's passionate about it and that's what they do and they firmly believe in. So instead of listening to one person talk about 10 different topics or 15 different topics, you know, someone said okay, I'm going to tell you about communication Tomorrow, I'm going to tell you about risk. The next day, I'm going to tell you about schedule. Next day, I'm going to tell you about scope. And it's like no, you have personhood. Their whole focus is communication or their whole focus is risk. It's interesting because there are a lot of cross classes in here cross information.
Walt Sparling:When I started, and I came up with the communication topic, which I had already, like I said, I got the idea from the book chapter that I did. I got the idea from the book chapter that I did. I found out that Melissa Chapman was doing something on communication and I poked around in the instructor files and I saw her outline and I was very concerned like oh God, we don't want to have two of the same. So Amanda, actually on the Pure team, took our two outlines and put them into chat, gpt and said compare these. And it went and said these are the areas that are the same, these are the areas that are different, these are complimentary. And and I was like oh good. And then I reached out to Melissa and told her and I was like you know, we're both doing and it seems like you're focused on this and I'm focused on more on this and she's like, yeah, so I was like, all right, so we won't have any conflicts, they'll, they'll be complimentary and there are other courses in there that are like that as well.
Tanya Boyd:That makes sense, your trigger and thoughts Cause? I remember I came onto the project a little bit later I think I had gotten asked in September and September and my first two ideas were communication and creativity, and I remember seeing yours and Melissa's on communication and Ben's on creativity, and so I started brainstorming other things and landed on the risk to rewards, which you know that was just more me flipping, being creative and being positive when you hit a lot of hurdles. Creative and being positive when you hit a lot of hurdles. So, but it was. It was interesting how everything played out with all of it.
Walt Sparling:And I yeah, and there's a lot of diversity in here too, not just similarities, like Dave Westgarth's course on, like I'm working on my Scrum Master certification and and so I'm doing anything I can. That's in that agile world and because I've my, my world has been waterfall forever, uh, but so I'm trying to broaden my horizons because I talked to a lot of uh, agile and and I talked to a I know a high level scrum master a couple years ago I interviewed. So the more I can learn about it, the more I can learn about it, the more I can talk about it and ask the right questions. So the diversity in this program is also good because I think it might take, especially if you're new, take something you're thinking about getting into and then maybe you take a course in one of these courses and you go whoa, that is not something I ever want to have to deal with.
Tanya Boyd:Or that's something I love. How do I get into doing work that involves this? So I agree, I agree, it is, you know, and I'm just thinking through that, you know, and I'm thinking of Candice with hers is on on, you know startups, you know.
Tanya Boyd:so it's like different industries to Jeff's on sustainability. It's like a lot of them are complementary but then completely different. So I think that a lot of that credit goes to Joe and Amanda and the team for selecting, you know, different people to fuel into this that were from different backgrounds, different industries and even globally. So that's one of the biggest values that I find is that not everybody sounds the same. We don't all talk the same and we're all bringing our own unique perspective, which does make it very different. I haven't seen anything else quite packaged the way that this is. Oh, no.
Tanya Boyd:And I love the way that they've done this and just the friendships that are forming and the people that we're going to help.
Walt Sparling:Yeah, and I'm not trying to push it because I think it's valuable, but I mean the cost is also crazy. You get your certification or your credential. You get all this diverse training. You get your certification or your, your credential. You get all this diverse training. You get your credly badge and you get 60 PDUs. So if you have any other PDU credential right, you can apply it to that. And if you already have a bunch of them and you go over, well, you can carry them into next year or not next year, but your next renewal your next cycle?
Walt Sparling:yeah, so and if you're tracking that stuff, if you go to the pm mastery website, pm-mastercom, and you go to the resource page, top link is a pdu tracker that not only you can track your history, whether it it be a book or a course or a podcast, even there are. There is a tab dedicated to pure and it actually goes through and it auto calculates all it. Well, you just put in the date that you completed it and it calculates your PDUs and then you can copy and paste the specific cells into the matching forms on the website. So you don't even have to type all that stuff out. You just go to that tab copy paste. Go to the. You know who's the. You know what's the course name copy paste. What's the description copy paste. And what's the PDUs copy paste or type in the number. It tells you every category of the triangle. So it's a very useful tool.
Tanya Boyd:I think I'm going to download that too, because I have been doing a lot better when it first launched on study and in this past few months I need to get myself caught back up on it, and I probably do need that tracker to keep me accountable and keep it in front of my face to make progress.
Walt Sparling:Well, I know I've been using it for years for myself and it helps me because I can look at any time. I don't have to log into the PMI site. Some people are like, well, I finish a course, I log right in and do it. That's great If you're kind of a collector of data and then you go in. I'll go in every few months, copy and paste everything in, get a bunch of PDUs at once feels really good. Or, like I did last year, I'll do it two weeks before it's due.
Tanya Boyd:And only if I do that. I caution people against that, because you never know what's going to happen or when you're going to forget. But I love the idea that you're doing it batch incrementally. I agree you don't have to do it every time you earn one PDU, but yeah, do it a bunch of them at once helps. But don't wait two weeks before. Yeah it wasn't.
Walt Sparling:I saw it and it goes oh, by the way, you have four weeks left to entry. And I'm like what, oh my God. So I went over to my and a lot of the stuff I do a lot of, obviously the podcast and the website. So I get credits, pdus, for all that. You have a limit. I believe it's 25 of your PDUs, but I don't collect all those when I do them. I just that's why I batch them.
Walt Sparling:I go okay, I did four podcasts in the last two months. I'm going to grab all four and put them all in my spreadsheet. Podcasts In the last two months. I'm going to grab all four and put them all in my spreadsheet so that when it, when it came up, I thought I had another year. I wasn't paying attention to the date. I'm like, oh, so I scrambled for two weeks getting everything entered and the cool thing is I did not have to go back and take any courses or sign up for any programs because I had met everything, I had done all my volunteer stuff, I had taken enough courses at work and through LinkedIn and oh, shoot, now I can't think of the one. Anyway, I had taken enough Udemy, taken enough material over the three years that I had everything. I just had to get it entered.
Tanya Boyd:Right.
Walt Sparling:Yeah, don't progress.
Tanya Boyd:I'm going to share one more very quick tip. I leapfrogged. I'm going to share one more very quick tip. I leapfrogged so what that means. My leapfrog is I got my PMP in 2014. I got my 60 PDUs within three months, submitted them. I've been doing that consistently since 2014, with every cycle once it's renewed. So my PMP is actually good through 2030 at this point.
Tanya Boyd:I don't think my cycle it bumps you up like a year if you do it really quickly afterwards. And that was the trick, because I've had people challenge me and go there's no way you're through 2030 and I was like yes, I've it if you catch it right as soon as you earn it or when that cycle opens up. You know like I think my cycle will open back up for submission in 2026. You know so what I'll do at that point is I'll apply, because I'm always doing talks, I'm always doing training Every three years, the eight years working as a practitioner. This I'll do it all at once and it'll jump me up ahead. You know so it's just as soon as it opens. But I'm like that with everything, whether it's my license, my registration sticker, as soon as it's due I'm on it, because the world changes quickly and we forget quickly and get busy. So it's like I keep, I just keep up with all of that. And um, I realized later that that's a, that's a trick that other people don't realize.
Walt Sparling:Cool. Well, I thank you for doing this, and this was fun. It was nice to be on the other side again. I don't get to do that too often, but I appreciate it and I appreciate everyone who's listened.
Tanya Boyd:And we will see you all in the next episode of PM Mastery.
Walt Sparling:Thank, you Tanya?
Tanya Boyd:You're welcome.
Intro/Outro:Thanks for listening to the PM Mastery podcast at wwwpm-masterycom. Be sure to subscribe in your podcast player. Until next time, keep working on your craft.